Interview with IRMCT President, Judge Graciela Gatti Santana, conducted by Amina Nuhanović.
For the thirtieth anniversary of the genocide in Srebrenica, please reflect on the judgements issued; has justice been served in full? How do you view the events in Srebrenica in July 1995?
The events that occurred in Srebrenica in July 1995 were deeply shocking for humanity. The International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY) and the International Residual Mechanism for Criminal Tribunals (the Mechanism, for short) heard cases against a total of 20 individuals, including high-level political and military figures, for crimes committed in Srebrenica, which resulted in 18 convictions. Seven of them were convicted for the crime of genocide. The judgements in cases concerning the Srebrenica Genocide have been significant from a legal point of view, as they analysed in depth the different elements of the crime of genocide and their interpretation continues to be authoritative for other courts adjudicating cases of genocide today.
I also consider that, with their judgements, the ICTY and the Mechanism have made a crucial contribution to upholding accountability, regardless of the positions held by the accused persons, and to establishing an accurate historical record. Both of these functions can play an important role in achieving sustainable peace and reconciliation, as I am a firm believer in what Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. said: “there can be no peace without justice.” Whether this has been enough for justice to be fully served is something that only those directly affected by the crimes can determine.
Can the families be satisfied with what The Hague has done? How many witnesses were heard and how many years of imprisonment were handed down for Srebrenica?
As I suggested in my previous answer, it is not for me to draw a conclusion on whether justice has been fully served or whether the families of the victims can be satisfied with the contributions made by the ICTY and the Mechanism. This applies not only in relation to the crimes committed in Srebrenica, but to all crimes committed during the conflicts in the former Yugoslavia. Furthermore, justice is only one link in the chain of processes that can lead to long-lasting peace and reconciliation and, as such, it has its limitations. It is important to remember that, while the Judges in cases of international crimes explore the context in which the alleged crimes take place, their primary task is to reach a decision on the individual criminal responsibility of the accused persons before them.
More than 1,000 witnesses were heard in ICTY and Mechanism cases concerning crimes committed in Srebrenica. It is humbling to know that so many people bravely set aside their personal fears and came to the court to speak of their experiences. They have undoubtedly been an indispensable part of the Tribunals’ ability to establish the facts, make judicial findings and render comprehensive judgements. Of the seven persons who were convicted for genocide in relation to the events in Srebrenica, five received life sentences and the other two were sentenced to 35 years of imprisonment each.
When you were first in Potočari, what was your personal feeling when you saw the “Valley of the White Tombstones”?
Having sat as a Judge of the Mechanism’s Appeals Chamber in the case against Radovan Karadžić, I was of course very familiar with the events that unfolded in July 1995 in Srebrenica. However, seeing the “Valley of the White Tombstones” in person was extremely impactful and gave me a new appreciation of the scale of the crimes committed in Srebrenica and the suffering they caused. To have a visual depiction of how many lost their lives, and to realise that so many more have been left behind mourning the loss of their loved ones, is something that deeply affected me the first time I visited Potočari and it continues to invoke powerful emotions every time I attend the commemoration ceremonies there.
How important are the judgements handed down by the Hague Tribunal against war criminals for crimes committed in Bosnia and Herzegovina? Could you reflect on the judgements of Ratko Mladić and Radovan Karadžić, given that you were a member of the Appeals Chamber in the Karadžić case?
I consider that all the judgements rendered in cases before the ICTY and the Mechanism have been important in serving the purposes I mentioned earlier, in terms of helping to combat impunity, advancing international criminal and international humanitarian law, and contributing to the long and difficult processes that can eventually solidify peace and reconciliation. I can also appreciate their importance as a recognition of the suffering of the victims of the crimes dealt with in those judgements.
The specific judgements convicting Radovan Karadžić and Ratko Mladić have additionally been significant in demonstrating that there is no impunity for international crimes, even when they are committed by those at the highest political and military levels. There is not much more I can say in response to your question, as the judicial deliberations process is confidential and these and other judgements “speak for themselves”, reflecting the comprehensive findings of independent judges based on the evidence presented to them.
Even today, we have cases of genocide denial and the aggrandisement of war criminals. What does that lead to and how do you view this denial of judgements from The Hague?
This is a very disheartening and unfortunate reality. The judgements were reached by independent and impartial Judges on the basis of extensive evidence that led them to be satisfied that their findings were proven beyond reasonable doubt – as is the standard of proof in cases before the ICTY and the Mechanism. Therefore, the facts as judicially established should be regarded as indisputable. Yet, we are indeed seeing in the region examples of the Srebrenica Genocide being actively denied, war criminals being treated as heroes, and attempts to revise history. I consider these phenomena to be very dangerous. They disturb the peace and reconciliation processes, ignore the lived experiences of the victims, and perpetuate the divisions that initially led to violence. Such voices might serve short-term political interests, but in the long-term they can hurt the whole region and jeopardise the future of the younger generations.
I do believe that the false narratives can be effectively countered, however this will require concerted efforts across the political, civil society, academic, media, and education spheres. In response to these phenomena and within the limitations of its mandate as an international criminal tribunal, the Mechanism is committed to continuing to promote its valuable legacy and that of the ICTY in order to raise public awareness about the events that occurred during the conflicts in the former Yugoslavia. The Mechanism Information Programme for Affected Communities (the “MIP”), funded by the European Union, has been undertaking some excellent initiatives in this regard. For example, the MIP runs workshops for history teachers on how to use the judicially established facts from ICTY and Mechanism cases in the classroom, and it hosts an annual video lecture series that gives students across the region the chance to interact together and learn more about the Tribunals and their work. I believe such initiatives can play a powerful role in the current context.
What is your message on the 30th anniversary of the genocide in Srebrenica?
On this occasion, my heart goes out to all of the victims and survivors and their families. My primary message is one of solidarity and sympathy for those who suffered so much and who, 30 years on, are still processing their traumas and grieving their loved ones. I extend my respect for their incredible bravery and resilience. I wish to highlight, too, that 30 years is a particularly long time for some families not to have yet found the remains of their loved ones, depriving them even of this minimum level of closure. Thirty years is also a long time for suspects of crimes to continue evading justice. Every effort must be made for both of these outstanding issues to be addressed.
At the same time, marking 30 years since the Srebrenica Genocide is an opportunity to take stock of the importance and meaning of remembrance; something that is highlighted in the resolution adopted in May 2024 by the United Nations General Assembly, which designated July 11th as the International Day of Reflection and Commemoration of the 1995 Genocide in Srebrenica. In this respect, it is time for serious focus to be placed on how remembrance can serve reconciliation. The young adults of today were not yet born at the time when the Srebrenica Genocide occurred, and yet they continue to live with – and be impacted by – the wounds of the past.
It is time for everyone to do their part in combatting the voices of hatred that attempt to deny historical events. Moreover, it is time for everyone to understand that perpetuating division and discrimination not only re-traumatises the victims, but also hinders societal advancement. I hope that the judicial findings of the ICTY and the Mechanism can contribute both to the work of local justice institutions, and to educational and remembrance initiatives that serve the above-mentioned objectives.
Can we expect the formation of a similar mechanism to try crimes in Ukraine, Gaza and Palestine? When would that be?
I am aware that there have been discussions on these issues in various fora since the beginning of the crises you mention. However, my position as an independent Judge and President of a United Nations criminal tribunal does not allow me to provide my personal views on the likelihood of establishing such mechanisms in relation to conflicts in different parts of the world. What I can say is that, if any entity were to be established for the purpose of seeking accountability for international crimes now or in the future, the lessons learned from the ICTY, the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda and the Mechanism, along with other criminal tribunals established with international support, will be extremely valuable in setting up and operating this kind of institution.
First published on Preporod.info, 4.7.2025. in BCS
Translated by Preporod.info
Peščanik.net, 14.07.2025.
